Hexblade Build

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Hexblade Build

Post  VeritasWaits on Wed Aug 03, 2011 4:23 pm

I've been fiddling around trying to come up with a good Hexblade build to play once it's released, so I thought I'd share and get some feedback. I'm going to skip the usual level by level breakdown until I have a chance to actually test it in game, but the basic build is:

Hexblade 22/Bard 4/Dragon Disciple 4

Will need to stagger Bard levels to take Curse Song + Rhyme of Misfortune, Extra Music, and Snowflake Wardance. I will likely take Able Learner to continue increasing Perform. Then Epic Feats will mostly go to improving the Hexblade's Curse and other abilities. Given all of the feats that I'd like sooner rather than later, I'll probably stick with plain vanilla Human, although if I can squeeze them all in naturally I'd like a race with a little more character (and ideally a CHA bonus).

4 levels of Bard also gives some basic, level 2 Bard spells to round out the Hexblade's spell buffs. Dragon Disciple is nice for the extra AC and STR, but not necessary if it feels too cheap.

I'm also thinking that a Hexblade/Arcane Archer/Elemental Archer could actually be really interesting, and it would be a nice change of pace to finally play a solidly powerful archer in NWN2.

Anyone have suggestions or comments? Or have any Hexblade related builds or plans of their own?

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Archaos on Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:15 am

I think with Hexblade you won't need Bard levels anymore since he is a spontaneous caster. And I'm not sure the HP, BAB, etc loss are worth the Curse Song.
I would make Hexblade/Blackguard. The stacking of bonuses and penalties are insane and fit a lot thematically.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  VeritasWaits on Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:48 am

Yeah I see your point. If you just took 4 levels of Bard and dropped Dragon Disciple, I think you'd only lose 1 BAB, so would still get your 6th attack (although I admit I'm more familiar with Spell DC and Caster Level than BAB and Attacks per Round, so I may be wrong on that?). Inspire Courage makes that up (and adds +1 damage), plus Snowflake Wardance adds up to +10 to your AB for something like 30 rounds, if you don't mind wearing light armor. And Curse Song is just fabulous IMO, huge hit to AC, Saves, Skill Checks, even does a little Sonic damage. I agree though that Hexblade is strong enough on its own that it doesn't really need any of those things, it's just a flavor preference that I think overlaps well.

Blackguard is interesting though. I don't tend to play evil aligned characters, so I've never used the class although I see it in a lot of builds. Were you thinking just 3 levels mixed in for the bonus to saves, or is Blackguard best as a full 10 levels PrC? The extra spontaneous spells, debuff aura, and the beefed up free summon Kaedrin added do look pretty tasty...

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Kaedrin on Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:47 am

Blackguard and Hexblade will not stack for +Saves. Nor will Warlock. Soon enough none of those will stack with each other.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Archaos on Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:30 am

I think they are supposed to stack in PnP... Are you doing it for balance reasons?

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Kaedrin on Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:32 pm

They should NOT stack in pnp.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Archaos on Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:07 pm

I have seen many Hexblade/Blackguard builds on forums and none, I can remember of, say that Arcane Resistance and Dark Blessing doesn't stack. One example.
Many even propose Paladin of Tyranny/Hexblade/Blackguard builds (Divine Grace/Arcane Resistance/Dark Blessing).

The reason is that all abilities are untyped bonuses and don't have the same name. Further research supports this.

"Unnamed Bonuses

A bonus that doesn't have a name stacks with anything except itself."

In the end it's your decision but I'm just saying what I found.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Kaedrin on Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:58 pm

Abilities that do the same thing do not stack per pnp. Adding a flat +Cha to save in 3 different classes is still the same thing. Thus it shouldn't stack. You can't add the same point of Charisma to your saves 3 times as that's doing the same. It's not like they are adding discretely separate +bonuses to saves (like if all three were like DivChamp then it wouldn't be an issue).

It's the same thing as Duelist and Invisible Blade boosting AC from Int. Both are untyped but neither stack per pnp because they do the same thing in the same way.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Archaos on Fri Aug 05, 2011 6:49 pm

I just find it hard to believe that so many people didn't notice it and I can't find evidence that supports this.

For example Gauntlets of Strength and Belt of Strength don't stack because they are bonuses of the same type, enhancement.
Ninja and Monk AC Bonus ability doesn't stack because it's the same exact ability.

Arcane Resistance and Dark Blessing stack because they are different abilities that give untyped bonuses.

In PnP abilities that do the same thing stack as long as they are not of the same type or are untyped.
At the bottom of this it says
" Bonuses with different names stack.
Bonuses with the same names overlap (don't stack)
Bonuses with no names stack with any other bonuses (but not with themselves)."

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Kaedrin on Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:45 pm

It's an issue of ambiguity and charops/most people exploit/abuse every possible loophole and ambiguity to maximize their character.

One rule says any untyped bonus stacks as long as the ability doesn't have the same name. One rule says bonuses from the same source don't stack. +x from (Charisma) is using Charisma as the source, even if the ability has a different name. It's the same reason that Canny Defense and Unfettered Defense don't stack (both +Int to AC).

It's possible it was an unofficial WotC dev FAQ like Richard Baker's (source of many of the warlock fixes) since I don't remember where I read it.

Regardless, it's how they are all going to behave soon enough (1.42).

Blackguard is still a good idea for the aura of despair, turn undead, spells, and sneak attack dice.

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Re: Hexblade Build

Post  Archaos on Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:57 pm

I believe also that too high saves are kinda an overkill. We might have Paladin/Hexblade/Warlock/Blackguard builds soon if not already.

Indeed Blackguard fits both mechanically and thematically.

A bit off-topic but I can't wait for some Blackguard goodness like the Summon Undead and the other spell additions. As well as the Epic Fiendish Servant.

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